The 5 Best Ski Jackets Reviewed For 2017

Picking the right ski jacket is a difficult task because it has to perform well in a wide range of conditions. Everything from well below zero to warm spring skiing while being waterproof and breathable at the same time.

The jackets reviewed here kept us warm, even on the ski lifts with the wind blowing. We did use a base layer with them on the colder days, see our favorite base layers here.

To give everyone an good option, we listed our top 5 picks in a wide price range to fit everyone’s budget.

Ladies: can skip to the best Women’s ski jackets here.

Two of the jackets are 3-1 jackets with removable insulated liners and one, the Arc’teryx would be considered a shell only with a light insulated liner. The Spyder Titan is a worthy contender as well.

First lets take a look at the ski and snowboard jackets, then we’ll talk about how to choose the right jacket for you.

  1. Columbia Whirlibird Interchange Jacket
  2. The North Face Carto Tri-Climate Jacket
  3. Spyder Squaw Valley Jacket
  4. Arc’teryx Beta AR Jacket
  5. Spyder Titan Ski Jacket

Here is a feature overview of the ski/snowboard jackets with full reviews and our buying guide below.

The Best Men’s Ski and Snowboard Jackets

 Columbia Whirlibird Interchange JacketThe North Face Carto Triclimate JacketArcteryx Beta AR Jacket
editors choice
The North Face Men's Carto TriClimate Jacket. Small
Shell:100% waterproof polyester 100% waterproof nylon100% waterproof GORE-TEX Pro
Liner:Omni-Heat Reflective Microtex polyester Insulation100% "Heatseeker" polyester insulationBreathable polyester liner
Features:3-in-1 jacket with removable liner, waterproof zippers and detachable hood3-in-1 jacket with removable liner, waterproof zippers and detachable hoodWaterTight pit zippers for ventilation, reinforced shoulders and elbows with N80p-X, helmet compatible Drop Hood.



Ski Jacket Reviews

#1 Columbia Men’s Whirlibird Interchange Jacket Review

Columbia is a company that has been around since the 1930’s and I have long touted as one of the best quality-value ratio outdoor gear manufacturers in the market. Especially if you’re lucky enough to live nearby a Columbia Outlet store, the value ratio of their product simply cannot be beat.

Columbia Sportswear Mens Whirlibird Interchange Jacket

Columbia Sportswear Men’s Whirlibird Interchange Jacket

The Whirlibird Interchange Jacket seems to be no different. It has a nylon outer shell with “selective seam taping” is not going to be completely waterproof in any major sense but we already know that’s not super critical in a ski coat.

Polyester insulation and inner lining is a great choice of materials and serves to move this jacket up on the list.

A removable hood is a feature I love on a ski coat and earns this jacket brownie points! Featuring an adjustable powder skirt really just seals the deal on this economy-priced jacket.

It’ll be hard to be disappointed in this jacket especially at the variety of price points it is available at.

If you don’t happen to be near a Columbia Outlet you can find this jacket for a killer deal on Amazon. For the style conscious skier/snowboarder, they have quite a few colors and styles available.

I would not hesitate to recommend this jacket for a full featured entry-budget skier jacket. In my opinion this is the best ski jacket for the money. Click here for Women’s Whirlibird

#2 The North Face Men’s Carto Tri-Climate Jacket Review

The North Face has been in the game of outdoor clothing since the 1960’s. Founder, Douglas Tompkins being dissatisfied with hiking jackets at the time decided he could do better and The North Face was born. For this reason their products are usually well thought out and not too far off base.

On the flip side, however, they’ve managed to wiggle their way into being one of the most widely recognized names in the industry and often charge a premium for products which may not truly be the best performers.

The Men’s Carto Jacket is a 3-1 ski/snowboard jacket that continues this tradition of quality gear and is the culmination of everything they have learned over the last 50 years.

The North Face Men's Carto TriClimate Jacket

The North Face Men’s Carto TriClimate Jacket

You’ll pay a decent price for the name brand and for the “breathable” HyVent fabric (North Face’s in-house fabric) but when you wear the jacket you will understand why it cost a little more than other jackets.

The breathable HyVent 2L shell when paired with their “Heatseeker” insulated liner makes it one of the warmest ski jackets available so you will stay warm even on the coldest of days.

And when spring season comes around, you can take out the insulated liner and just use the completely waterproof shell.

Their HyVent insulation really sets this jacket apart from the fleece-crowded market.

Your going to pay a little more for the Carto jacket but you will have a jacket that is going to give you years of service and with its flexibility, you can use it all season long.

As with most ski/snowboard jackets, it comes in several styles and colors, one of them is sure to suite your style. Click here for Women’s Tri-climate.

If you afford to spend a little more the The North Face Carto jacket is a great ski/snowboard jacket.

#3 Spyder Squaw Valley Ski/Snowboard Jacket Review

The Squaw Valley ski/snowboard jacket is one of Spyder’s least expensive offerings but being made by Spyder you are ski getting a worthy contender for your money.

The Squaw Valley has 80 grams of 3M Thinsulate insulation so you know it will keep you warm. However it does not have a removable liner like the Columbia Whiribird or North Face Carto jackets so that’s a minus in my opinion.

spyder-squaw-valley-ski-snowboard-jacket

Spyder Squaw Valley Jacket

However, I can count on one hand the times I have actually removed the liner from my Columbia jacket, the only time you will is if your spring skiing when it’s really warm out.

In those conditions breathability and being waterproof are far more important.

The Squaw Valley jacket is 100% waterproof with “Spylon (DWR)” coating, waterproof zippers and taped seams. With the Bemis anti-abrasion resistant shell it will last you many seasons.

If you tree line ski, it will hold up and resist the scratches from tree branches you will encounter.

It of course has a removable and adjustable helmet compatible hood plus it comes with wrist gaiters to keep the wind and snow out, even if you take a digger. You’re going to be comfortable all day on the slopes with its “core ventilation system” keeping you dry and comfortable.

Even being one of Spyders most inexpensive ski jackets, you will not go wrong with this jacket. Click here for the Women’s model.

#4 Arc’teryx Men’s Beta AR Jacket Review

If Columbia is a company I have touted as value based, Arc’teryx is absolutely (in my opinion) the opposite. Without a doubt it is the outstanding “premium” name brand in the outdoor gear world.

Arc’teryx is a Canadian based company that got its start making products for the military and moved into the civilian market in the late 1990’s

In my opinion many of their products do not deserve the high price tags. However the Beta AR ski/snowboard jacket is not in that category.

Keep in mind that, unlike the other jackets I reviewed, this one does not come with a removable insulated liner.

Arc'teryx Mens Beta AR Jacket

Arc’teryx Men’s Beta AR Jacket

This jacket is primarily a shell with a thin layer of insulation but amazing it is incredibly warm. On really cold days I would use a good breathable base layer or a sweater.

The high-end GORE-TEX® Pro waterproof fabrics combined with reinforced shoulder and elbows make this one the most rugged and long lasting jackets on the market.

The Beta AR jacket has a helmet-compatible, easy to adjust hood plus a separate collar to keep out the cold air.

The jacket includes large “pit-zips” for ventilation when its warm out which is a critical inclusion in my book.

One of the odd features left out was the lack of a powder skirt. This is without a doubt a ski/snowboard jacket that will last you many years and with its flexibility is much more than just a ski jacket. Click here for Womens Beta AR.

If you can afford to spend the extra money for this jacket, you will not regret it.

#5 Spyder Titan Ski/Snowboard Jacket Review

Spyder was founded by David Jacobs who was an Canadian Olympic skier in the late 70’s when he decided he could do better than the ski jackets they were using at the time. The company was moved to Boulder Colorado where it is still headquartered today.

They are one of the official suppliers to the US Ski Team so that should tell you something about the quality of Syper Jackets.

spyder-titan-review

Spyder Titan Ski Jacket

The Titan is one of Spyder latest offerings and in my opinion is one of the best ski jackets on the market. It is definitely one of the warmest ski jackets with its 60g of Thinsulate insulation while maintaining a thin and flexible design.

The jacket has all the necessary features of a quality ski/snowboard jacket like a removable helmet compatible hood. The jacket is fully waterproof with all seams fully taped plus an abrasion resistant coating on the vulnerable parts of the jacket.

The Spyder Titan has a removable power skirt that is a necessity in my opinion. The Titan also has a ventilation system for spring skiing or when the weather turns warm.

While certainly not the cheapest ski/snowboard jacket, you could pay a lot more for less of a jacket. The Spyder Titan’s racing roots show through with this jacket. It won’t make you an Olympic skier but you may feel like one wearing the Spyder Titan. Click here for Women’s Titan

The Best Women’s Ski and Snowboard Jackets

#1 Columbia Women’s Whirlibird Interchange Jacket Review

Just like the Men’s Whirlibird reviewed above this is one of the best womens ski jackets on a price/value basis. It features their patented “Omni Tech” shell that is waterproof and windproof for protection from the elements.

The Women’s Whirlibird has their “Omni-Heat” technology, which is a fancy way of saying the liner of the jacket reflects your body heat, keeping you nice and toasty. Especially nice on the ski lifts with the wind blowing.

Being a mid-range price jacket, only the “critical seams” are taped for extra water resistance. Unless it is pouring rain, this should not be an issue.

The jacket has a hood that folds neatly into the back, though honestly with almost everyone using helmets, the hood is rarely used.

Even at the price point the Columbia Whirlibird is at, it has underarm venting for when the weather turns warm. This is a great ski and snowboard jacket for a bargain price.

#2 The North Face Women’s Cinnabar Triclimate Jacket Review

The North Face, makers of quality outdoor apparel since the 60’s has a winner here with the Cinnabar Triclimate. This is a “3-1” jacket so effectively you are getting 3 jackets for the price of one. The inner fleece liner unzips and comes out for a standalone coat or when you just want to use the shell for warm ski conditions.

The breathable “HyVent” shell fabric allow this jacket to breathe keeping you warm and dry by allowing any moisture to evaporate from the jacket.

The North Face’s “Heatseeker” insulated liner makes this an extremely warm jacket.

For the style conscious skier, the jacket is available in a variety of colors to match your preference and ski pants. The Cinnabar has “pit zips” for ventilation if conditions turn warm and you need to cool off.

There is a fully adjustable hood that can be removed completely. This is a solid mid-range ski and snowboard jacket.

#3 Spyder Women’s Amp Jacket Review

Spyder is an official supplier to the US Olympic team so that should tell you something about the quality of Spyder’s outdoor apparel. The Spyder AMP is their latest offering for a quality Women’s ski and snowboard jacket.

The AMP has 100g of 3M Thinsulate insulation in the liner of the jacket which is on the heavier side meaning this jacket is above average in warmth.

The Thinsulate keeps the jacket lightweight and thin while still providing plenty of flexibility. Being a 3 layer jacket, it has a membrane sandwiched between the shell and liner providing an extra measure of waterproofing and breathability.

The AMP uses Syder’s “Spylon” which is a waterproof, water repellant finish that beads water up and lets it roll off so it cannot penetrate the shell. Not only does it keep water out it provides resistance to dirt and stains keeping it looking brand new for years.

The “critical seams” are taped for an extra measure of water resistance and has zippered hand pockets for storage or to keep your hands warm when not wearing gloves. There are a variety of colors available so you should be able to find one to match your style.

Spyder has always been one of my favorite brand of jackets and the Sypder AMP is an excellent choice.

#4 Arc’teryx Women’s Beta AR Jacket Review

Stepping it up a notch in quality, performance and price is the Arc’teryx Women’s Beta AR Jacket. Arc’teryx is a premium brand from Canada who got their start from making clothing for the Mounties.

The fit and finish of the jacket is flawless, providing unrestricted movement for when you are carving up the slopes. This is not a “3-1” jacket and is primarily a shell. It features a Gore-Tex shell for unmatched water and wind resistance.

If conditions warrant, there an adjustable hood that stows away when not needed. For ventilation there are “pit zips” that are water tight. For extra durability the shoulders and elbows are reinforced ensuring this jacket will last you a long time.

Being primarily a shell, you will need to layer with this jacket, which is the way to go in my book anyway for ultimate flexibility.

The Arc’teryx Women’s Beta AR Jacket is not cheap but if you are looking for the best quality that money can buy, this jacket is for you.

How To Choose A Ski/Snowboard Jacket

Best Ski and Snowboard Jackets

It seems like outdoor gear companies these days are using every hype word they can think of (or make up) to get people excited and extremely confused about what they’re actually buying.

We’re going to set you straight when it comes to buying your next ski jacket. This article will take you through what to look for, what to avoid, and how to smell that BS when the local outfitter tries to sell you something you don’t need.

Once you understand what to look for in a ski/snowboard jacket you’ll be able to make a decision which saves you money and improves your skiing experience.

What is Layering?

If you’ve dressed for the outdoors before, you’ve probably heard of layering. Layering is a methodology for dressing which leaves the wearer with many varying combinations of clothing that can accommodate a wide range of weather eventualities.

In other words: wearing a shirt, sweater, and jacket gives you more options than just wearing one really thick coat.

Types of Layers

We’re going to break down layering here into only two main groups:

Shells

Shells are the outermost layer and are very critical to the success of a good layering plan. Shells have one primary job – to create a barrier between you and the weather. Shells are usually either windproof, waterproof or (ideally) both. If your shell is waterproof it is also windproof. The reverse is not always true.

Insulation

Insulation comes in two flavors – natural and synthetic. The three main examples are merino wool, polyester, and goose down. For the cold winter months down insulation is probably the best, albeit most expensive, choice. Insulation layers always go under the shell and are primarily responsible for trapping and retaining body heat.

Types of Ski and Snowboard Jackets

When it comes to ski jackets we’re going to look at a few styles with different approaches to layering:

Modular “3-in-1” Jackets

Becoming very popular in the last few years are the modular jackets. These jackets take an all-encompassing approach to layering and, when you purchase one, they come with everything you need to make 3 separate layers.

Here’s how it works: You get a shell and an insulation layer when you purchase a 3-1 system. The only real neat feature here is that they’re usually made to zip together.

Why is this even important? Because, when zipped together, you have a single jacket which acts as your insulation and shell in one. When zipped apart you can choose shell or insulation – or both.

These systems provide an easy no-brainer type solution to layering.

The major downside? You’re stuck with whatever combination of shell and insulation the manufacturer deems appropriate. This isn’t so good for customizing but you can always just get a different shell insulation later and swap them out. The The North Face Carto Tri-Climate Jacket is an excellent example of this type of jacket.

NOTE: Additional shells or insulation layers may not fit the zipper system of your original 3-1 coat so you may have to wear them as individual layers (something I prefer to do anyways).

Insulated Shells

Most lower-end ski jackets are the “insulated shell” type of jacket. It is far and away less versatile and adjustable than a 3-1 layering system, the insulated shell comes with thick insulation permanently sewn inside the jacket.

I’m not a fan of this type of jacket, mainly because they tend to be heavier and bulkier than a 3-1 modular jacket.

This really sucks when its spring skiing conditions and everyone else is stripping off layers while you’re soaked in sweat inside your non-adjustable coat. If you plan on doing any spring skiing then I would not consider this type of jacket, even though you may save some money.

There are very few situations outside of polar exploring where insulated shells have an advantage over good adjustable layering systems.

Only consider these options for the most extreme cold conditions.

Soft Shell Jackets

A relatively new option in jackets. This type of jacket is a hybrid of a hard shell and an insulation liner such as a fleece jacket. This jacket is not a bad option in warmer conditions early in the season or spring skiing where it tends to be warmer. They do not offer the same water resistance of a hard shell but if don’t fall often or its not raining then I think this a good way to go. I would consider this only if you ski frequently and have other jackets.

Hard Shell Jackets

This type of jacket is mainly for protection from the elements, like wind, sleet and snow. A great example of just a quality hard shell is the Arc’teryx Beta AR Jacket. When you choose this option you are choosing the “Homemade layering” (see below) I would consider this option for a frequent or experienced ski/snowboarder who needs maximum flexibility with their layering.

As you get to know the conditions and what layers works best, you can dress exactly the way you need to. For the once a year skier/boarder the 3-1 modular jacket is probably a better option, like the Columbia Whirlibird Interchange Jacket or the The North Face Carto Tri-Climate Jacket.

Homemade Layering Systems

It’s worth noting here that it is possible and, often, advisable to create your own layering system. Selecting your own hard shell jacket and insulation layer (or multiple different layers of insulation) means you have full control over every variable.

Most outdoor professionals will choose this method due to the superior level of control provided in choice of gear.

Homemade layering system won’t be able to zip together into a single garment the way 3-1 systems do but that’s a very minor drawback when compared to the great benefits offered by choosing your own appropriate clothing layers.

Choosing a Ski and Snowboard Jacket Shell

Picking a shell can be a confusing process when you begin to consider how many features and options are out there. On top of this, manufacturers are always trying to come up with new ways to make common features sound like the most groundbreaking thing since the wheel. Let’s talk about what you really need to know:

Waterproofing

Waterproof layers are really only necessary if you’re planning to ski in spring conditions. For the majority of skiers, a waterproof shell is absolutely not necessary for resort skiing.

Waterproof breathable shells are all the rage and hyper expensive. They’re really not necessary and you’re a lot further ahead letting your upper body “breathe” by halfway unzipping the jacket or opening the “pit zips” found in higher end jackets for ventilation.

Before shelling out the beaucoup bucks for waterproof breathable shells, consider how likely you really are to end up in a situation where you’re getting rained on while skiing.

When you’re looking at the spec’s for ski jackets you may notice a water resistance rating. It is usually expressed in mm or mil. This rating describes how water resistant the jacket is. It’s a bit technical but it goes like this.

Take a column of water and how high the water column needs to be before the water soaks through is its “mil” rating. For example, if the jacket is rated at 5,000 mil, it will take a column of water 5,000 mm’s high (200 inches) before it can start to soak through the shell of the jacket.

Most jackets are rated at least 5,000 mil with real high end jackets going all the way up to 20,000 mil. Not all jacket makers use this scale or the rating for their jackets.

Another term you see thrown around is “taping” and there are two taping methods. First is the “fully taped” seams, meaning that ALL seams have been sealed with some type of coating to make sure water does not get in and provides a measure of extra durability. You will find most high end jackets “fully taped” like the Spyder Titan Ski Jacket.

There is also “critical taped” this tends to be on more mid-range jackets and means that only the major seams like the sides and outside of the arms are taped for extra water resistance.

Windproofing

Windproof layers which are not waterproof are often less expensive. These jackets are sometimes called “soft shell” jackets. In most winter time resort skiing conditions a softshell outer layer is just the right amount of weather protection.

Advantages of softshell windproof layers include flexibility (made from stretch material) and much better breathability than even the most advanced waterproof coats.

Breathability

Another term you are likely to hear in regards to jackets is “breathability”. It has its own rating like waterproofing. The breathability of the outer shell is measured in “grams”. This rating tells you the amount of water vapor, (perspiration) will evaporate through the material in a 24 period.

Like mm or mil, the higher the better and of course the more it costs. It can be useful when comparing jackets and is mainly only a consideration if you ski in warmer conditions or a hard charging skier who works up a sweat.

If you are a backcountry skier who hikes for a few hours to get to the location, then breathability is a more important consideration for you. For the rest of us, this is really not that critical.

Fit and Sizing

If you are choosing a shell only jacket, make sure you order a size or two larger than normal for you is definitely important. Why go up a size?

You’ll want room under that shell for your insulation layer. The other consideration is the length of the jacket. If you have a longer torso, be sure to get a jacket that is cut longer. Not all jackets will reach much past your waist.

In my mind a longer jacket is better because they will help keep the cold and snow out. This is especially important for beginner skiers/boarders who tend to fall more often and will get snow inside of their jacket if it doesn’t reach far enough down. A “snow/powder skirt” can prevent this however. (discussed below)

If you’re buying a 3-1 system then simply choose the size which fits you best.

Ventilation

Extremely critical for a good shell layer – ventilation options. My personal favorite, and the option I think is most critical in choosing a shell, are “pit-zips”.

Large zippers under the arms are great way to dramatically increase the temperature range at which your shell layer can be worn.

Powder Skirt

Another mandatory feature is a powder skirt.

Most ski shells come with an elastic cord around the bottom hem to help seal the jacket against the weather. Don’t confuse this with a true powder skirt – powder skirts are inside the jacket, usually a handful of inches above the bottom of the garment, and provide and additional adjustable seal around your waist to keep out the snow when you take a digger.

Hood

If you’re skiing with a helmet (and you should be, see our ski helmet reviews here) then a hood really isn’t going to do you any good.

Look for shells with removable or stowable hoods. Often times feature-rich shells have a small pocket into which the hood can be stashed. Some jackets feature a “helmet hood” but these are usually meant for covering climbing helmets and often won’t fit the larger ski helmets.

Helmet skiers are left with the beanie option for extra warmth though it’s rarely necessary with a good helmet.

Extra Features

Some of the better ski jackets offer some extra features that can come in handy and some are necessities in my book. One feature you may find on jackets are “pit zips”, these are a necessity in my book. When unzipped they allow plenty of air flow under your arms when you start getting warm. They allow you to regulate your temperature you your liking.

Some jackets have special ski pass pocket, now that most ski mountains give you card instead of the clip on paper pass, this can come in handy on the lift line.

Most jackets come with adjustable and storable hoods but now that most people wear helmets this is not much of a benefit anymore. I cannot remember the last time I used mine on the slopes. Make sure there are plenty of pockets for keeping snacks, phone, water, a neck gator etc.

Choosing Insulation

Once you’ve smartly chosen your favorite shell, you’ll want to start looking at insulation. Don’t ignore this even if you’re buying a 3-1 system because understanding what insulation you’re buying is really important to making an informed buying decision.

Fleece

Fleece comes in many thicknesses and weights. Windproof fleece is amazing and if you can find it, don’t hesitate to pay the extra price.

Look at the fleece in your 3-1 jacket to make sure it’s thick (or thin) enough for your needs. Not all 3-1 jackets are made the same!

Fleece is really just specially woven polyester!

Synthetic

Okay, I know fleece is synthetic, but it has its own category. Synthetic insulations are usually some variation of polyester insulation trapped inside a nylon garment. There are as many different colors, brands, and warmth variations out there as you could ever imagine.

Synthetics are great for wet conditions where your insulation might become soaked. This is only a real potential in spring skiing.

Down

You won’t find down insulation unless you take the DIY approach to making a layering system or, if you’ve got the budget, you start considering extremely high end 3-1 layering options.

Down usually comes from geese but sometimes you’ll find duck down. These little feathers are hyper-insulating and extremely lightweight. Added benefit? They’re highly compressible meaning you can smash your jacket into a tiny ball for packing.

Drawbacks include high price and a severe loss of insulation if the down becomes wet. Maybe not the best choice for late spring skiing.

Packability

Alright, I made that word up, you caught me. It is, however, worth noting that many insulation layers come with the cool feature of being able to pack down inside of their own pockets for luggage and travel. This is a feature I have enjoyed many times.

Best Ski Jacket Brands

This is a bit subjective of course and if you ask 10 skiers what the best brands are you will get 10 different answers. There are some ski jacket makers that always seem to get mentioned and not by coincidence they are the jackets reviewed here.

These jacket makers have been around for a while and have excellent reputations for making quality equipment.

  • Spyder
  • Arc’teryx
  • The North Face
  • Helly Hansen
  • Columbia

Spyder is almost always at the top of everyone’s list, and since the US Olympic team trusts them, you can too. Arc’teryx, a Canadian company, who makes jackets for the Canadian Mounties, so you know this is a quality brand as well. Columbia is usually on most peoples list. They are in my opinion one of the best price/performance brands on the market.

The North Face is a good option as well, many people swear by this brand and Helly Hansen who is probably better known as a maker of Women’s jackets is a great option as well.

Please check out our reviews on Ski Base Layers, Socks, Helmets, Gloves, Goggles and Pants.

Click here to return to the reviews.

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Picking the right ski jacket is a difficult task because it has to perform well in a wide range of conditions. Everything from well below zero to warm spring skiing while being waterproof and breathable at the same time. The jackets reviewed here kept us warm, even on the ski lifts with the wind blowing. We did use a base layer with them on the colder days, see our favorite base layers here. To give everyone an good option, we listed our top 5 picks in a wide price range to fit everyone's budget. Ladies: can skip to the best…

Review Overview

Warmth
Comfort
Ventilation
Value

Summary : We rate the Columbia Whirlibird Interchange Jacket the best overall ski jacket for the price. The North Face is slightly better is your budget allows it. They are both 3-1 modular ski jackets providing the ultimate in flexibility.

About caseyf

I am an avid outdoorsman with experience in naturalist education, outside adventure education, ski instruction, and writing. In addition to my outdoor hobbies, I’m a huge fan of punk rock. I have launched several start-ups. (or business ventures) When exploring the backcountry, I usually carry less than 10 pounds of gear. Years of experience have taught me to pack light. I enjoy sharing my experiences of backcountry education teaching and guiding through writing.